Which type of education is best?

Bunny · Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 4:28 pm Post subject: Which type of education is best?

Alright I've got a bit of a dilemma, and I need some advice from people who might have some experience, Ex. you guys already in college. I want to go into graphic design/web design, but mostly web deisgn. There's two schools I'm looking at, one is a school where my mom lives, the other is the school where Stealth is going.

Here's my problem though. I don't know what type of education is better for what I want to get into. The school where my lives is called Columbus College of Art and Design, and as you can tell from the title, its a very "artsy" school. Where Stealth is going (ETSU) you take your regualr university type classes like Phyisics and then your technology classes.

At the art school, everyone is required to take these classes called Foundation Studies, for your freshmen year. There classes like Drawing, 3 and 2 dimensional design, Color Concept, Fundamentals of Painting, Structual Drawing, Digital Design, History of Art...etc.

Then later you get into classes like Advanced Typography, Illustrastion Methods and Techniques, more boring classes but you also get to pick electives like Photoshop Imaging, Web Design 2, Animation, Media Design...etc. You end up coming out with a B.F.A degree.

At ETSU, I would be looking at thier Digital Interaction part of thier Digital Media Program. I would have to take general education classes like Critical Thinking, Probablity and Statistics, History, Physics, all that. Then the digital interaction concentration classes are focused on:

Animation
3-D Modeling
Web Design
Vector and Raster Based Imaging
Motion Tools
3-D Animation
Product Design
Interaction Design
Character Animation Lab
and so on...

and you end up coming out with a B.S degree.

So the bottom line is what type of courses are better for me? More artsy, drawing, type classes, or more general education, and technology classes?
_________________

Wang Chung · Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 4:38 pm Post subject:

TBH, if you wanted to do web page design primarily (which you will kick ass at), you'd probably want to go with a traditional route over an artsy school. Maybe I'm biased, but i think you would be way better off going to a standard place for something technological like webpage design, whereas if you wanted to become a artsy graphic designer then you would go to the other place.

Quote:

Animation
3-D Modeling
Web Design
Vector and Raster Based Imaging
Motion Tools
3-D Animation
Product Design
Interaction Design
Character Animation Lab

Sounsd a lot funner and more useful than:

Quote:

There classes like Drawing, 3 and 2 dimensional design, Color Concept, Fundamentals of Painting, Structual Drawing, Digital Design, History of Art...etc.

Then later you get into classes like Advanced Typography, Illustrastion Methods and Techniques, more boring classes but you also get to pick electives like Photoshop Imaging, Web Design 2, Animation, Media Design...etc. You end up coming out with a B.F.A degree.

Just my 3 cents Smile

_________________
is now -=|CT|=- Frothy Mixture

Erwin Rommel · Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 5:27 pm Post subject:

There is more than enough time in college for both general classes and your major. It seems to me that having a broad base of education certainly can't hurt.

But I've always been a sucker for a liberal arts education.
_________________
-=|CT|=-Descartes

Brutus · Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 5:56 pm Post subject:

Here is my 2 cents:

Art school - what you learn never changes (traditional eye for balance, color, and general "rightness"). This becomes a better foundation for follow-on skills. The market for these skills alone is probably not as good as a more technical background.

Tech school - what you learn is outdated tomorrow so be ready to keep learning. However, employers are always looking for people that know that newest stuff so you are more likely to get a job out of the gate.

These are HUGE generalizations of course. If you want to be the uber designer you will need the artsy background (or a true gift for the sublime). Once you go the tech route there is less time to learn new stuff becuase you need to work just to stay abreast of changes.

Like everything, there is no easy answer. Do what makes you happy. Anything you are willing to happily work MORE at will generally be better for you (personally and financially).
_________________

AxeBlind · Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:07 pm Post subject:

To prevent burnout, which I am suffering badly, I say pick the one that would best translate to what you want to do. After that, choose the one where you would have the most fun at. College is about learning, but it is also a tme for you to learn about all kinds of things and have fun. The school where you have to take lots of basics would be my choice. My favorite class I have had so far was an Intro to Anthropology class I had to take. Sometimes the required are what you really cherish and remember.

But I'm mad too.
_________________

ChrisT · Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 6:13 pm Post subject:

Erwin Rommel wrote:

There is more than enough time in college for both general classes and your major. It seems to me that having a broad base of education certainly can't hurt.

qfe I would stick with a non art school major. But I am very biased.

With a BS you get to have university requirements (math, science, communication) = strong base.

In all reality you will be better off with the art major.....

that is if you KNOW that you want to be a website design artist. But with an arts major you will have very little room to switch jobs if you think "this sucks" The thing with a strong base and a bs degree you always have room to switch around.

What I would do:
Start off in the non-art-school and take your basic university req, along with a touch of your design classes. (your freshmen and maybe sophmore year) Then if you say damn, I really want to do this for the rest of my life, then transfer to arts school. This way if you see greener grass you can always jump the fence.

However before you do this talk to the arts school and see if they would accept a transfer of credits, along with what credits you would transfer. (they may not accept some of the credits you take)

Worst case scenario is it could set you back a year/ one semester. But lots of people are going to college for 5 years instead of four now.

**Also like Axe said you can take lots of stupid courses at a big university that will stay with you for the rest ofyour life. I LOVE my communicaton course, it kicks ass and is teaching me a lot about behavior(it's like psychology only the cool stuff) Not to mention I'm taking scuba diving next semester, and plan to get certified.
_________________
Submit to Milky Way

Rally Monkey · Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 7:25 pm Post subject:

Brutus wrote:

Here is my 2 cents:

Art school - what you learn never changes (traditional eye for balance, color, and general "rightness"). This becomes a better foundation for follow-on skills. The market for these skills alone is probably not as good as a more technical background.

Tech school - what you learn is outdated tomorrow so be ready to keep learning. However, employers are always looking for people that know that newest stuff so you are more likely to get a job out of the gate.

These are HUGE generalizations of course. If you want to be the uber designer you will need the artsy background (or a true gift for the sublime). Once you go the tech route there is less time to learn new stuff becuase you need to work just to stay abreast of changes.

Like everything, there is no easy answer. Do what makes you happy. Anything you are willing to happily work MORE at will generally be better for you (personally and financially).

QFE

Nice answer Brutus. The artsy school. Art concepts, painting with color etc etc etc never change whereas technology alwats does.

Slaughter wrote:

In all reality you will be better off with the art major.....

that is if you KNOW that you want to be a website design artist. But with an arts major you will have very little room to switch jobs if you think "this sucks" The thing with a strong base and a bs degree you always have room to switch around.

Good response also Slaughter. Bunnah Sluaghter does bring up a point to be mindful of. Art School if you absolutely know that is what you want to do.

At the bank our best designers are the ones that went the artsy route.

We now have 12 designers working full time BTW.
_________________
Go Phuck yourself

Bunny · Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 7:38 pm Post subject:

I know I don't wanna get into Advertising and all that. I mentored in a printing business last year, and it was boring as hell. Right now I'm mentoring at the local newspaper here, and they design ads, which is better than the printing business but still not excatly what I wanna do. I like being creative and I love web design, yet I don't know too much about it cuz my high school sucks and the only class we have is a Multimedia class that I'm taking this year and we just now started learning HTML.

That's the one thing I'm worried about with the art school, its seems like so much hands on drawing rather than computer graphics drawing, and major is called Adversting and Graphic Design.
_________________

Rally Monkey · Posted: Sun Feb 26, 2006 7:49 pm Post subject:

Bunny wrote:

I know I don't wanna get into Advertising and all that. I mentored in a printing business last year, and it was boring as hell. Right now I'm mentoring at the local newspaper here, and they design ads, which is better than the printing business but still not excatly what I wanna do. I like being creative and I love web design, yet I don't know too much about it cuz my high school sucks and the only class we have is a Multimedia class that I'm taking this year and we just now started learning HTML.

That's the one thing I'm worried about with the art school, its seems like so much hands on drawing rather than computer graphics drawing, and major is called Adversting and Graphic Design.

Hmmm our designers design both WEB BANNER ADS and WEB PAGES
http://www.indymacbank.com

A lot of they do involves "Usability" which means sometimes they sacrifice their art because of bunsiness needs/requirements. It becomes a balancing act for them.
_________________
Go Phuck yourself

SupaFly · Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 1:56 am Post subject:

well, since im going to what would be considered a "tech" school, i can speak from exp on that end... all the color theory/artsy part of multimedia design wont be ignored, you actually do quite a bit of it, its just buried into the classes more & not named in the class (although, one of my intro classes was called color theory) & while you might think the tech part may become outdated, how much has photoshop changed in the last 5 years (i took 3 years off school & didnt miss a beat) so i wouldnt be too worried as the core will stay pretty much the same

also, as the technology grows, 2d will end up being phased out in a lot of ways.... designers are alreay running into things that are easier to model & take a render of, rather than draw out... and with a model, you can rotate, re-light, change backgrounds, etc in a snap... some things are a lot harder from a more traditional approach

as for the art school, if they want to develop the creative side, thats all well & fine, but without a solid foundation in the technology, you could get left behind pretty quickly... and when it comes down to it, they only teach you the rules so you can break them... a really good designer will NEVER follow all the rules... its what gives everyone their own style & makes things interesting

also, if they have the web design as electives, theyre probaly way underfunded & written off as "niche" classes... it may or may not be true, but its something to think about... PS will be a pretty big part of what you wanna do & if they just kinda skin over it, you might get left in the dark on a lot of things... also if they dun bother to show you the coding end of it, you will probaly end up totally lost

but like everyone said, what it ultimately comes down to is what you would be more comfortable with, we can preach & go back & forth all day, but remember to take us all with a grain of salt because in the end, youre the one who has to go Razz

(but at the same time, a lil sage advice goes a long way in the hands of someone who knows how to use it)... i also think having someone you know helps A LOT!!! (for me anyway) if youre the only person you know that is gonna go to the art school, it may be a bit harder to adjust, but thats something that can always be overcome

if it was up to me, id take the tech school... credits transfer much more easily if you get a year into & find out it isnt gonna be what you thought itd be (and at least in my program, they try to guide you towards the advertising/printing area, because its the most common area for designers to get into) you can bail & keep a lot of credits....

a good idea would be to talk to the ppl in charge of the departments youre interested in & find out how deep each one goes into different things... knowing about degas is all well & fine, but probably wont help too much when its time to do a web page for the used car lot down the road, or the golf course in town (which youll be doing a lot of if you start your own biz, or start in a smallish one)... anyway, ask LOTS of questions, if you think of something good, get a notebook & put a question at the top of every page & take notes about how each college responds to the question... it might give you the make or break piece of info you need

just remember in the end youre doing it for you, so make sure youre armed with as much info as you can get... i know a thing or 2 about letting someone else tell me what kind of school i wanted to go to & it really cost me a lot... but i guess it isnt all bad, i did learn from doing things the wrong way too... either way you go, youll be getting something that you can use someday, just pick the one thatll give you the things you wanna use
_________________

Bunny · Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 1:45 pm Post subject:

Thanks a lot guys, it really helps.

I'm planning on visiting the ETSU school with my mom soon, and I'll be sure to ask lots of questions.

I've visited the art school, and it's a nice place in all but I just have an odd feeling about it. I remember when I went to visit and the girl was telling us how we should start painting with gawash or something before we started freshmen year....and I was like wtf is that? That's the thing that scares me with the art school, it seems like it's taking a huge art class and I haven't taken an art class since 8th grade. I just have an odd feeling about the whole thing so thats why I'm thinking its not right for me.
_________________

GotMilk? · Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 4:48 pm Post subject:

IMO, all designers of any sort should go through a hands on art class, painting, drawing, etc. It's the back to basics thing for me. So many people get into web and graphics design without any sense of artistic vision for lack of a better term. They throw things together and wonder why they don't work, and it's mainly because of a lack of understanding. I've done 4 years of art classes for that reason. Learning what works and what doesn't, learning textures (which is the biggest thing that bugs me today about 2d designing, there is a lack of texture, which is one of the most important things in any kind of art), etc, etc.

Honestly, if it were me, I would take the art school. I'm not entirely sure on how deep the tech schools get into the basics, but if they have you doing any hands on stuff, then that's awsome, I would change my mind in a heart beat.

The thing is, the technical side of most 2d (and some 3d) programs you can learn so quickly, it's not even funny. I just goofed off in PS about a year and a half ago, not really doing anything with it. It wasn't until about 5-6 months ago that I seriously started getting into it, and found out how easy it really is.

My opinion is, any monkey can be taught to work a computer program (literally), but the artistic vision is what counts, and THAT is what will get you a job, and set you apart from most graphic and web designers today. Like I said, just my 2 cents, take it or leave it.

Corbin · Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 7:12 pm Post subject:

io think that the traditional EUTSO or whatever it was called is the safer bet but it wouldnt put you ahead.

theres thausands of kids whos graduate with specializations in digital media adn such, and i think in order to start kicking ass you need something to put yourself ahead of the rest so you arent just another graphic designer among thausands. if you went to the art school you would start out a little bit behind the graphic design kids, but with some work and dedication i bet you could pull your self to their level and then with the things you have learned in art school go above and beyond them.
_________________

Its been a While my dear Ct

Cap'n Sprite · Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 7:20 pm Post subject:

Porn is the best study, trust me. Razz

Naw, for real now, this is very interesting. If fact I'll read this whole thread a litle later cause I have no idea of what to study when I graduate H.S and this PC making website thing really seems like something I would like. So thanks Bunny for making the thread anad everone for commenting.
_________________

Bunny · Posted: Mon Feb 27, 2006 7:54 pm Post subject:

No problem Smile

_________________